Does chapter one of the earliest gospel (Mark) portray Jesus as the God of Israel, as Yahweh himself? This is part of what Dr. Michael Bird argues in this second half of the debate. For his part, Dr. Bart Ehrman counters that many ancient Jewish sources feature deified humans, and so it is plausible that even though the synoptic gospels (Mt, Mk, Lk) don’t say that Jesus is God, the slightly later gospel according to John does teach that. Do the four New Testament gospels then clash about Jesus and God (as Dr. Ehman argues), or do they all in fact teach that Jesus is God (as Dr. Bird argues). Or, as I argue, do none of the four New Testament gospels teach that Jesus is God himself, or that he’s divine in the way that Yahweh is divine? Here’s the argument I discuss at around 22:30, when I say that “things that are identical to the same thing are identical to each other.” f= g j = g g = f (1, reflexivity of =) j = f (2, 3, transitivity of =) Dr. Bird seems to be suggesting that the gospels teach both 1 & 2. But that would me that they imply 4 as well, which is unacceptable! (In all of the NT, Jesus and the Father differ, and so by the indiscernibility of identicals, they must be two.) I admit this argument is valid, but I affirm 1 and deny 2, so I hold it to be unsound. You? Let us know what you think in the comments below, in our Facebook group, upload audio feedback for possible inclusion in a future episode of this podcast, putting the audio file here. You can also listen to this episode on Stitcher or iTunes (please subscribe, rate, and review us in either or both – directions here). It is also available on YouTube (you can subscribe here). You can support the trinities podcast by ordering anything through Amazon.com after clicking through one of our links. We get a small % of your purchase, even though your price is not increased. (If you see “trinities” in you url while at Amazon, then we’ll get it.) Links for this episode: the official debate video: “How Did Jesus Become God?” – Bart Ehrman and Michael Bird in Dialogue + Q&A The Greer-Heard Point-Counterpoint Forum Dr. Bart Ehrman, How Jesus Became God Dr. Michael Bird, How God Became Jesus podcast 128 – Ehrman and Bird on How Jesus Became God – Part 1 Mark 1:1-11 Proving that Bush = Sgt. Speedo A formulation of Leibniz’s Law / the Indiscernibility of Identicals Daniel 7:13 Psalm 110:1 Mark 13:32 Mark 14:61-64 Does Mark teach that Jesus is God? Mark: Jesus is God’s Son, the Messiah God and his Son: the logic of the New Testament 1st Century Christian Ebionites – The Original Christians? Theodotus The Tanner Acts 2:36; Acts 13:32-33 Segal, Two Powers in Heaven Jesus’s argument in John 10 Ehrman’s misreading of John 10:30 podcast 63 – Thomas Belsham and other scholars on John 8:58 John 17:1-3 John 20:17 podcast 70 – The one God and his Son according to John podcast 13 – On Bauckham’s Bargain This week’s thinking music is “Unknown Things“ by Robbero. The post podcast 129 – Ehrman and Bird on How Jesus Became God – Part 2 appeared first on Trinities » Podcast Feed.
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